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 CrazyTronnersOpenSumoServer (or just sumo servers general) 
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I'm not sure if this has been said or is possible, but i thought it would make it fairer if the teams spawned exactly the same distance apart from each other when there are only 3 teams in a zone.
The way it is setup now, i think the team that spawns in the middle is at a disadvantage when there are only 3 teams in the zone.
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agreed, but that implies quite much hacking I think.

spawn points are defined in the map, so you'd have to define spawn points depending on the number of teams, or chose the map according to the number of teams (and know in what zone there'll be 3.

It is possible, but with a script.

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scripting won't always work either, the updated number of teams can only be found after the map has been added to the grid. It would be easier to implement as a game hack, i think (but i am not sure how).

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Sumo is all luck anyway. I don't see how it matters.
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I don't think this is what sinwav means by luck but it made me think of this.

The spawn points are determined by team points. The players are spawned from lowest to highest team points by default. This is why there are always less in the circle that has the teams that are at the top of the ranks. Of course there is a setting in sty+ct that can reverse that process. I've always thought the winners should be more crammed then the looser in my opinion.

I also forgot to say in my prior post here that maybe in a few weeks i'll look into a way to change the spawn points.

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sinewav wrote:
Sumo is all luck anyway. I don't see how it matters.


Luck is a myth. There is only CT_emmy... errr.. i mean lag... errr... /me has an interesting mental disorder.

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sinewav wrote:
Sumo is all luck anyway. I don't see how it matters.

Yeah, that's why that's always the same players who are winning there. They are luckers Wink

EDIT:
btw, may be just switching spawn 2 and 3 in each zones should do the trick. Let's see :
IIRC, spawn points are placed that way in each "pod" :
1-> 3V


4^ <-2

so lowest score is spawned in pos 3 having a disadvantage compare to 1 and 2 (leading team).

switching 2 and 3 (and spawn direction):
1-> <-2


3-> <-4

so now, leading team will have the disadvantage. Assuming, leading team is better than the other Wink it will be fairer ...
and it's still fine when there's only 2 teams ...
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Done.
However I'm not sure how to avoid spawning single team in a zone this way Razz
Try and complain for some time, I've also changed max allowed teams/clients from 12 to 8

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Sir Kyle wrote:
the updated number of teams can only be found after the map has been added to the grid


What if the map has 12 spawn points.
If there are 4 teams, they spawn in position 1,4,7 & 10
and if there are 3 teams they spawn in position 1,5 & 9
I'm not sure if its possible but this will at least eliminate the need to switch maps i think.

Voodooman wrote:
so now, leading team will have the disadvantage. Assuming, leading team is better than the other it will be fairer ...


I disagree i've always thought that it wasn't fair for the top 2 teams when they have to fight each other and would usually take longer (because they are better and its easier to stay alive with less people) and be awarded less points. While a close trailing 3rd place team in the noob zone have a better chance of getting more points faster off of weaker teams when a match is close near the end of the match.

Sinefeld wrote:
Sumo is all luck anyway. I don't see how it matters.


I know you are just joking...but you keep repeating the same joke over & over again so i'm starting to suspect.... Smile
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1200 wrote:
I disagree i've always thought that it wasn't fair for the top 2 teams when they have to fight each other and would usually take longer (because they are better and its easier to stay alive with less people) and be awarded less points. While a close trailing 3rd place team in the noob zone have a better chance of getting more points faster off of weaker teams when a match is close near the end of the match.


True if there's 3 "good" teams and 2 "less good" teams, but I fear there's no solution that will fit all the cases.
The only adjustment that can be done is to have the 3 leading teams fighting in 1 spot and the 2 last one in another but in this case, the leading teams can get more points which give less chance to the lasts to come back...
Or you can still spawn players/teams randomly but in this case there will be "luck" involved ... At least, having the leading teams fighting together is more challenging and more rewarding for the winner. Additionally, having this behavior predictable is better so you can take it into account in your strategy Wink
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The only adjustment that can be done is to have the 3 leading teams fighting in 1 spot and the 2 last one in another but in this case, the leading teams can get more points which give less chance to the lasts to come back...


I think it should be like that. I don't see why trailing teams should be rewarded by getting more chance to come back for their poor performance in the preceding rounds.....With such arrangement it actually might even out the survival times between the two zones a little more, because now its easier for the teams in the noob zone to survive longer and harder for the leading teams to survive with more teams.
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hmm, bug. There was only 3 teams. I spawned at the other zone. Screenshot:




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1200 wrote:
Sir Kyle wrote:
the updated number of teams can only be found after the map has been added to the grid


What if the map has 12 spawn points.
If there are 4 teams, they spawn in position 1,4,7 & 10
and if there are 3 teams they spawn in position 1,5 & 9
I'm not sure if its possible but this will at least eliminate the need to switch maps i think.
It does not just pick spawn points.
for sumo it takes the spawn points and groups the in pods of 4 (by the order they are placed in the map)
then if there are 4 or less players the first 4 spawn points are filled up
if there are 5 it takes 3 from the first pod and 2 from the second and continues this till they are both at 4 and it keeps doing this.

the was i was thinking about hacking it was going to just ignore spawn points in maps, i dunno how easy or had it will be, i'll probably start taking a look tomorrow.

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Has this been mentioned to Zman or the developers?
For such a simple arrangement not being able to be performed makes this game not as good as it could/should be.

Perhaps they could be fixed from the developer's side for the future releases??
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Ok, let's try to figure out what your solution means :
- First, you'll have to define 12 spawn points per group where only a subset of them, 6 actually, will be used.
- Second, once we have spawn point position, the direction. How to be fair with 4 axes ?
- Third, after that, you'll probably want to see teams/players equally spread among "spots" (some sumo maps have 2, others 4). So when you have 6 teams, you'll have 3 teams per spots on a 2 spots map, 2 teams per spots on a 4 spots map.

Of course, all this depend on different parameters: spawn group size, nb of axes, number of spots, ...

Actually spreading players/teams among spot is quite simple.
Deducing the correct spawn point to use from a group of 12 (or any other value) is not more complex.

BUT :

- map designer will have to handle all these spawn points manually.
- due to the number of axes, having the spawn points equally distant is still "completely" fair.

Well, you can still ask dev team to implement your idea. I'm not sure you'll be able to convince them the effort required, even as low as it seems, will worth the expecting improvement, and the unexpected side effects (like adding complexity to map making) ...

Show me a fair set of spawn points (including directions) for 3 players which can be generalized and I'll be pleased to implement it ... Smile
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