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 New ladder aint so good. 
Mad
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Hello, I don't really mind but I just want to suggest this to make it better and I'm not the sort to leave or change teams when I'm loosing so I don't mind if my rank is low, but the ladder system really doesn't work perfectly in my opinion.

Basically someone who isn't that good can join and play against a noob and win them 50 times and loose zero times and have a much better ratio then the current top player on the ladder. Now the only way to beat that guy would be to go around making sure you win every round and not loose once or he beats you by simple ratio.

My suggestion on fixing this is simply incorporate the ladder so it reflexes the matches played and not the winning ratio. I'm not saying it should be the amount of matches played but something different then what is currently being ranked.
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ratio's shouldn't be as important as ladder points imho.

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Jedi
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Theoretically what you're saying is true. But if there's two people at CTWF, more usually show up pretty quick, so it would be very difficult to accomplish what you suggest. Plus, I'm not sure anyone cares that much.
Although the ladder is not perfect by any means, I think that would be impossible, it does give a good indication of skill level. Those at the top are the players I fear the most on the grid. If I have a good day I go up on the rankings, a bad one, I go down.
It's as much about performing well as it is being on the winning team.
Here's the current equation, which is flawed.

Code:
( ave_cordumps - ave_coredumped - ave_teamkilled - ave_suicides ) x %age rounds_won

so for me and infa at time of writing:

inf: ( 1.16 - 0.25 - 0.02 - 0.04 ) x 75.41 = 64.09 < the ladder has a more accurate figure as it doesn't use rounded values
ed: ( 0.67 - 0.36 - 0.05 - 0.12 ) x 60.28 = 8.43 <


How would you suggest it is changed?
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Mad
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I'm not quite sure to actually give a good suggestion but does ave_teamkilled and ave_suicides count on your overall value/rank? If so I totally disagree with teamkills let alone suicides effecting your rank, as sometimes you get someone that dies and you get the penalty for their mistakes. And afew times some idiot on my team desides to die on my wall and again I get the penalty. And somtimes when someone TK's you and you try to escape but don't make it, it gets counted as suicide. I'm not blaming the ranking system but simply the flaw in the game shouldn't effect the ranking system.

I think the best way to rank everyone would be to remove all team results and only count what the player individually does. For example, How many times that player kills per match/game compared to how many times he plays match/game. Or score based where the highest kill counts. As always the best players are on the top of the score bored. (Just a thought.)
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I disagree... I think it is really good the way it is now. The ONLY way it could be better is if you could somehow give handicap to lower ranked players so that (A) they don't earn the better players as many points if beaten and (B) the worse players get more points if they beat a better player. The only way I can see this happening is based on their current ladder score. For example, if I kill Infamous (68.95), it should count more than if I killed Ed (15.89).

Now, if I killed legionnaire (-8.97) it should NOT count against me though. So, gotta be careful. I would say make the lowest ladder sort value equal to 100% scoring, and the highest ladder sort value equal to 200% scoring, and everything in-between would be a ratio of that. If -8.97 was the lowest (100%) and 68.95 is the highest (200%), simply subtract the lowest from the highest scores and the score you are checking (in this case minus a negative adds 8.97) and make that the 100% additional points. In this way killing Ed would earn...

68.95+8.97 15.89+8.97
------------- = -------------
100% (1) . . . . x

x=

24.86
------- = 0.319 = an additional 31.9% bonus for killing Ed.
77.92

(sorry the formatting is screwy).

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Mad
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It's a nice idea but I personally don't find that very appropriate for this type of ranking system. The current ranking system is rating people of per-game won. So anyone who just simply wins the round can be the 'best player.' The simple point I'm trying to get across is that it doesn't reflect the total skill of that player.

Adding bonus kill would be quite useless as it isn't even added to your score. (If ed's quote is all of it.)

Also ave_teamkilled - ave_suicides just makes it even worser.
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You don't get penalised for tking, not your fault a member of your team runs into your wall.
You get penalised for suicides or being tked, shouldn't have put yourself in that vulnerable position.

Wars idea is a good one, but a lot of work to implement.

The current ranking system is rating people of per-game won

Well, it's percentage of rounds won multiplied by your pesonal peformance based on kills.
If you are a very good player (like those at the top), your team will win more matches than then they lose, you should be awarded for this.

If you consistantly win most of your rounds, kill a lot and don't get killed much, you do well on the ladder.
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is there anyway you can log who is in a deploying zone. If so i think that the ladder should be affected by that too.

then what about shooting anyway to get that into edlog? maybe shots hit / shots fired to show how well one can aim? then in addition ad players shot to it if possible.

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In theory it should work in reality who knows if it will work.

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I've been meaning to use ave_points/2 instead of coredumps, as someone suggested a while back. This will take into account points scored for shooting. Currently you lose points for that annoying dz that appears when things get boring - I'm working on a replacement to the dz.
These things won't have a massive effect on the ladder.
What I would like to fix is the flaw in the overall ladder equation that penalises you for having a good win rounds ratio if you're not a killer.
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kyle wrote:
is there anyway you can log who is in a deploying zone. If so i think that the ladder should be affected by that too.

then what about shooting anyway to get that into edlog? maybe shots hit / shots fired to show how well one can aim? then in addition ad players shot to it if possible.


I think this is a good idea because in my view defense is easier to get kills in then in offense
so maybe based on the size of the zone, you could give a certain amount of points and if more then one ppl captures the zone, u divide the total by the amount of them

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 Glaring Ommision 
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obviously theres been some sort of statistical error,

currently

( time_spent_playing/social_life * quitting when you join a team of noobs * dont change name ) = points up the ass

change to


( ave_cordumps - ave_coredumped - ave_teamkilled - ave_suicides ) x %age rounds_won x the_size_of_your_balls

then i would be numero uno
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Mad
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You don't get penalised for tking, not your fault a member of your team runs into your wall.
You get penalised for suicides or being tked, shouldn't have put yourself in that vulnerable position.


So you get penalised if someone joins the server and TK's you at the start or when you're grinding and some dumbass splits right away or splits early during the grind? Image that kind of statistics on a Counter Strike server where people care about their rank.
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The trouble for arma server is it's difficult for it to deduce what's a teamkill, suicide or coredump. It does a fairly good job, but will never be perfect.
The main thing you get awarded for is not dying through the round, that we know for sure.
And it's exactly the same for everyone. Spotting and avoiding tkers is all part of the challenge Wink

the ladders are not perfect, and I don't wish them to be taken seriously. It's just some fun, but there's no denying, the best players are at or around the top.
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hahaha lol i was watching the ladder and pressed the reload button and inf wasnt on it anymore Very Happy
i hope he will get his internet back quick Smile
the ladder may not be perfect but its the best of all servers Very Happy

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ed wrote:
The trouble for arma server is it's difficult for it to deduce what's a teamkill, suicide or coredump.

can you count the TK of a player and add penalties if it exceed 3 per round? it's not the best but it can involve few mass tkers like those on the center (sometimes hole doesnt prevent it and ppl dying at mass)? or some combination of TK and dying after while?

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